I'm not perfect, so I have no right to judge others. It's a choice I personally wouldn't make (for various reasons, some of which have nothing to do with religion), but I could care less if other people do it. I do get pretty tired of people telling me how stupid they think my decision is though.
I watched this (I'm not OP), and I found it interesting and true! But not the truth. The thing is, is that it's very storybook.. because what he speaking of is reality in the form of a story. That is the danger with religion, it's one big metaphor to explain reality.. but people are literally lost in the story. It's like the bible is the finger that points to the moon, but people mistaking the finger for the moon itself!
OP here... I'm not trying to find excuses for living my life in any particular way, I just have lots of friends with different opinions so I was curious what others thought as well.
I was brought up into the Christian/Anglican faith as a young child but I have since fell out of it since high school.
I have had sex before marriage, as had a few of my closest friends and family. Instead of looking towards my original faith for guidance, I just look at myself as one with a clean slate like everyone else. Just live your life the way you want to, because I personally will not judge.
I'm waiting for marriage as well. I don't look down on other people's choices though it would be amazing if people can realize the beauty in waiting for marriage. It's not easy. There's gonna sexual tensions at times, which is normal because sexuality is part of our human nature but waiting is going to make it so special on my wedding night. And also, if a guy is willing to sleep with me when we're not married, what's gonna stop him from sleeping with other women when we are married? Waiting for marriage is not withholding love, rather it's an expression of love. I could be dating someone who is not my future husband. If I love him, I would want to protect him for his future bride and I hope that if my future husband is dating someone else at this time that the woman he is dating will do the same. In Matthew 5:27-28 it says "You have heard that it was said, 'YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT ADULTERY'; but I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart." I only included that quote because you asked for Christians' thoughts. God intended sex in the context of marriage and it makes sense to me. Of course, God gave us free will so you can choose to live your life however you want to. You can choose to accept or reject God's teachings. No one, not even God can stop you. I personally will not judge, no one else will (and if they do it doesn't matter). What you choose to do is between you and God. The question I have to ask myself (and you can ask yourself too) is will my choice/actions lead me closer to God or away from God? Our response is determine by our desire for God. Do we want to be with God or not? It's up to us.
By your logic, if a guy is willing to sleep with you when you are married, what's going to stop him from sleeping with other women when you are married? I respect your views but don't even begin to assume that because a guy sleeps with someone before marriage, he will cheat.
If you're using the "developmentally delayed" definition of "special" then you're right on the money. I'm just being literal. Anyone who's never had sex will be awkward as hell, and having two full grown adults feeling their way through it makes me cringe. I guess you'll get there in the end though.
I don't judge, it's your life to do as you please. However, that being said, I personally feel that it's very hard to know if you're sexually compatible with someone, if you've never had sex before. Society tends to downplay the importance of sex in relationships, but as many a former virgin will tell you, communication about such a potentially awkward topic can take quite a while to develop (if it ever does). Sex is a huge part of a functional romantic relationship, and I personally view getting married before having sex to be tantamount to blindly marrying someone you've only ever known through the internet. Sexuality is a huge facet of your partner (and yourself) that you are willfully ignoring, if you chose not to explore it.
The bible and religion in general are effective in many ways. They preach morality, community and kindness. But I believe this particular facet is outdated, and should be relegated to the same spot as, for example, women not being allowed to speak in houses of god. Corinthians 14:34-35: Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law.
This is, of course, just my opinion, and I 100% respect your ability to make your own choices. I just thought i'd chime in with my 2 cents.
Totally agree. Even if you assume sexual compatibility you're still missing out on the chance to develop communication on a level above the day to day. Sex isn't the only awkward topic that's likely to come up and if you haven't practiced talking about awkward but harmless things then you'll have more trouble with the really important stuff.
I disagree. There is no such a thing as sexual compatibility. If both are inexperienced virgins on wedding night, how can any of them tell how "good" the sex is? Plainly, I think they would just think that it's good since there is no point of reference. I don't see any problem with waiting until marriage to have sex. Sex cannot be the cornerstone of ANY romantic relationship. If both you and your SO place sex at such a high pedestal and keep it at that pedestal even when you're married (cause lets face it, any romantic relationship should ultimately be to pursue marriage), then you will find that as you grow older and sex isn't as enjoyable or possible that your relationship will start to crumble. But if sex is not on a pedestal, and instead emotional intimacy and sacrificial love is the focus on your relationship, I think it would be less likely to decay.
In terms of that verse, please read it in context. The author of that 1 Corinthians was talking about prophesy and speaking in tongues. You can read more about it if you want here: (http://www.gotquestions.org/women-silent-church.html) Without context, its like a child telling their mother he could have a puppy because the father said "he could have a puppy." When really, the father said "son, you let your goldfish starve to death. you really expect me to say 'sure, you can have a puppy.'?"
@13c "there is no such a thing as sexual compatibility" .......says the person who has never had sex before.
You really can't make such a bold claim when you yourself have never had sex. Trust me, sexual compatibility exists... Some people have chemistry some don't. Some people are into kinky things in the bedroom and some aren't. How would you like to save yourself under the assumption that sexual compatability doesn't exist just to find out your new husband who you've been saving yourself for has been watching a specific type of porn and is into whips and shit and that does the opposite of turning you on. Or what about the opposite, you really like to have sex and your partner can't get it up (male)/ doesn't actually want to have sex with you much at all (male or female).
I'm not saying you have to have sex before marriage, to each their own, but don't go preaching like you know everything about something you know nothing about. Sex shouldn't be the main component of a relationship but it is important- it's probably the most private and intimate way you can connect with your spouse.
Ps. Old people fuck too.. But I guess if you have that mindset already you're setting yourself up for a sexless marriage later in life.
@13d Someone elseon the internet has worded my response to sexual compatibility better than I can:
" What people see as a lack of compatibility is much more a lack of love, a lack of understanding, a lack of commitment. In love, my heart's desire is to please my beloved; her desire, to please me. Whatever our preceding sexual history, whatever our prior sexual preferences, we change (without second thought) to better suit the one we love. When you find yourself with someone who is unwilling to do that, it is not a sexual compatibility issue, it is a matter of love (or the lack thereof). Without love, sexual compatibility is much a matter of mechanics -- getting a shoe that doesn't pinch -- and if that's all it is, that's sad because it can be so much more! —Zalmar"
“...that does the opposite of turning you on.” First off, if the person is watching porn even before marriage, I’d seriously reconsider marrying them. If they’re okay with watching others have sex (and often masturbate along with it) while we’re dating, then what makes me think that they will be faithful at all in our marriage? They’re essentially cheating on you. Watching porn is not much different than going into a room where a couple are having sex and masturbating to it.
"...can't get it up" Erectile dysfunction isn't a sexual compatibility issue, its a health and sometimes psychological problem.
"doesn't actually want to have sex with you much at all" If a couple is deeply in love with one another and have a strong bond of companionship and emotional intimacy, I don't see why they would not have a sexual desire for one another. Men have a stronger libido than women. Does that mean that most men therefore are sexually incompatible with women because most women do not want to have sex as often as men?
Yes, I do know. My point was that sex cannot be the cornerstone of your relationship (marriage). When you both grow older, and do not look as good anymore and probably cannot perform as well sexually, then the relationship will begin to deteriorate because the glue holding that relationship together is sex. Sexual ability deteriorates with age, but emotional intimacy and bonds grow stronger and remains with age.
I'm not Christian, but a lot of my good friends are. It's not just denomination, it's all personal, obviously. Family and friends are massive influences and can judge harshly. I find people judge you more harshly "if you have" than "if you haven't".
Are you asking for yourself or for someone who's Christinan that you're hoping to sleep with. I know a lot of guys who go to church, consider themselves Christians and sleep with their girlfriends. Girls are more reserved, I've found from just knowing them. All in all, who really cares. It's your one shot at life, do what you think is right and will make you happy in the long run. No regrets bro/sister.
P.S. Reference to Captain Jack Harkness... If if it moves
I don't think it's my business to tell anyone I know how to live their lives, as long as they're being true to themselves and what they believe in. For people who only want to experience their sexuality in the security of a marriage and only share themselves with one person, that's cool. For people who want to experience their sexuality in many ways with different partners, that's cool too. For people who want to experience their sexuality with partner(s) in committed relationships, that's also cool.
I don't understand people who partake in all sexual activities excluding penile-vaginal intercourse just to tout themselves as somehow morally superior because they're "virgins". I think if you're going to be abstaining, you need to have some sort of broader definition of sex than just penis in vagina. I'm fine even if people want to go full-Duggar and have chaperoned dates and save hand-holding for engagement and kissing for their wedding day. I don't think you have to be religious to want to save sexual activities for marriage either.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteI'm not perfect, so I have no right to judge others. It's a choice I personally wouldn't make (for various reasons, some of which have nothing to do with religion), but I could care less if other people do it. I do get pretty tired of people telling me how stupid they think my decision is though.
ReplyDelete+1 :)
Delete+2
DeleteDo whatever you want, its not my life, it is yours. I personally do not tell you how to live your lives.
ReplyDeleteI have this one Christian friend that says she doesn't judge, but will always say "I don't agree with your lifestyle" :D
ReplyDeleteare you looking for a guilt free way to reason out having sex before marriage?
ReplyDeletehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-1tjV39WmaI
ReplyDeleteI watched this (I'm not OP), and I found it interesting and true! But not the truth. The thing is, is that it's very storybook.. because what he speaking of is reality in the form of a story. That is the danger with religion, it's one big metaphor to explain reality.. but people are literally lost in the story. It's like the bible is the finger that points to the moon, but people mistaking the finger for the moon itself!
Delete^Too eloquent for the internet.
DeleteOP here... I'm not trying to find excuses for living my life in any particular way, I just have lots of friends with different opinions so I was curious what others thought as well.
ReplyDeleteI was brought up into the Christian/Anglican faith as a young child but I have since fell out of it since high school.
ReplyDeleteI have had sex before marriage, as had a few of my closest friends and family. Instead of looking towards my original faith for guidance, I just look at myself as one with a clean slate like everyone else. Just live your life the way you want to, because I personally will not judge.
I'm waiting till marriage, but I don't look down on other people. I'm hoping to find a guy who'll be willing to wait too.
ReplyDeleteHi :)
DeleteHey [ :
DeleteCatholic here, and as others have said, it's your choice and your life; I'm not one to judge.
ReplyDeleteI'm waiting for marriage as well. I don't look down on other people's choices though it would be amazing if people can realize the beauty in waiting for marriage. It's not easy. There's gonna sexual tensions at times, which is normal because sexuality is part of our human nature but waiting is going to make it so special on my wedding night. And also, if a guy is willing to sleep with me when we're not married, what's gonna stop him from sleeping with other women when we are married? Waiting for marriage is not withholding love, rather it's an expression of love. I could be dating someone who is not my future husband. If I love him, I would want to protect him for his future bride and I hope that if my future husband is dating someone else at this time that the woman he is dating will do the same. In Matthew 5:27-28 it says "You have heard that it was said, 'YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT ADULTERY'; but I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart." I only included that quote because you asked for Christians' thoughts. God intended sex in the context of marriage and it makes sense to me. Of course, God gave us free will so you can choose to live your life however you want to. You can choose to accept or reject God's teachings. No one, not even God can stop you. I personally will not judge, no one else will (and if they do it doesn't matter). What you choose to do is between you and God. The question I have to ask myself (and you can ask yourself too) is will my choice/actions lead me closer to God or away from God? Our response is determine by our desire for God. Do we want to be with God or not? It's up to us.
ReplyDeleteBy your logic, if a guy is willing to sleep with you when you are married, what's going to stop him from sleeping with other women when you are married? I respect your views but don't even begin to assume that because a guy sleeps with someone before marriage, he will cheat.
DeleteIs the actual bible quote "SHALL" or "SHALT"? I can never seem to keep this straight.
DeleteIf you're using the "developmentally delayed" definition of "special" then you're right on the money. I'm just being literal. Anyone who's never had sex will be awkward as hell, and having two full grown adults feeling their way through it makes me cringe. I guess you'll get there in the end though.
DeleteI don't judge, it's your life to do as you please. However, that being said, I personally feel that it's very hard to know if you're sexually compatible with someone, if you've never had sex before.
ReplyDeleteSociety tends to downplay the importance of sex in relationships, but as many a former virgin will tell you, communication about such a potentially awkward topic can take quite a while to develop (if it ever does). Sex is a huge part of a functional romantic relationship, and I personally view getting married before having sex to be tantamount to blindly marrying someone you've only ever known through the internet. Sexuality is a huge facet of your partner (and yourself) that you are willfully ignoring, if you chose not to explore it.
The bible and religion in general are effective in many ways. They preach morality, community and kindness. But I believe this particular facet is outdated, and should be relegated to the same spot as, for example, women not being allowed to speak in houses of god.
Corinthians 14:34-35:
Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law.
This is, of course, just my opinion, and I 100% respect your ability to make your own choices. I just thought i'd chime in with my 2 cents.
I agree with 13 on all accounts. Very well written response.
DeleteTotally agree. Even if you assume sexual compatibility you're still missing out on the chance to develop communication on a level above the day to day. Sex isn't the only awkward topic that's likely to come up and if you haven't practiced talking about awkward but harmless things then you'll have more trouble with the really important stuff.
DeleteI disagree. There is no such a thing as sexual compatibility. If both are inexperienced virgins on wedding night, how can any of them tell how "good" the sex is? Plainly, I think they would just think that it's good since there is no point of reference. I don't see any problem with waiting until marriage to have sex. Sex cannot be the cornerstone of ANY romantic relationship. If both you and your SO place sex at such a high pedestal and keep it at that pedestal even when you're married (cause lets face it, any romantic relationship should ultimately be to pursue marriage), then you will find that as you grow older and sex isn't as enjoyable or possible that your relationship will start to crumble. But if sex is not on a pedestal, and instead emotional intimacy and sacrificial love is the focus on your relationship, I think it would be less likely to decay.
DeleteIn terms of that verse, please read it in context. The author of that 1 Corinthians was talking about prophesy and speaking in tongues. You can read more about it if you want here: (http://www.gotquestions.org/women-silent-church.html)
Without context, its like a child telling their mother he could have a puppy because the father said "he could have a puppy." When really, the father said "son, you let your goldfish starve to death. you really expect me to say 'sure, you can have a puppy.'?"
@13c "there is no such a thing as sexual compatibility" .......says the person who has never had sex before.
DeleteYou really can't make such a bold claim when you yourself have never had sex. Trust me, sexual compatibility exists... Some people have chemistry some don't. Some people are into kinky things in the bedroom and some aren't. How would you like to save yourself under the assumption that sexual compatability doesn't exist just to find out your new husband who you've been saving yourself for has been watching a specific type of porn and is into whips and shit and that does the opposite of turning you on. Or what about the opposite, you really like to have sex and your partner can't get it up (male)/ doesn't actually want to have sex with you much at all (male or female).
I'm not saying you have to have sex before marriage, to each their own, but don't go preaching like you know everything about something you know nothing about. Sex shouldn't be the main component of a relationship but it is important- it's probably the most private and intimate way you can connect with your spouse.
Ps. Old people fuck too.. But I guess if you have that mindset already you're setting yourself up for a sexless marriage later in life.
@13d
DeleteSomeone elseon the internet has worded my response to sexual compatibility better than I can:
" What people see as a lack of compatibility is much more a lack of love, a lack of understanding, a lack of commitment. In love, my heart's desire is to please my beloved; her desire, to please me. Whatever our preceding sexual history, whatever our prior sexual preferences, we change (without second thought) to better suit the one we love. When you find yourself with someone who is unwilling to do that, it is not a sexual compatibility issue, it is a matter of love (or the lack thereof). Without love, sexual compatibility is much a matter of mechanics -- getting a shoe that doesn't pinch -- and if that's all it is, that's sad because it can be so much more!
—Zalmar"
“...that does the opposite of turning you on.”
First off, if the person is watching porn even before marriage, I’d seriously reconsider marrying them. If they’re okay with watching others have sex (and often masturbate along with it) while we’re dating, then what makes me think that they will be faithful at all in our marriage? They’re essentially cheating on you. Watching porn is not much different than going into a room where a couple are having sex and masturbating to it.
"...can't get it up"
Erectile dysfunction isn't a sexual compatibility issue, its a health and sometimes psychological problem.
"doesn't actually want to have sex with you much at all"
If a couple is deeply in love with one another and have a strong bond of companionship and emotional intimacy, I don't see why they would not have a sexual desire for one another. Men have a stronger libido than women. Does that mean that most men therefore are sexually incompatible with women because most women do not want to have sex as often as men?
Yes, I do know. My point was that sex cannot be the cornerstone of your relationship (marriage). When you both grow older, and do not look as good anymore and probably cannot perform as well sexually, then the relationship will begin to deteriorate because the glue holding that relationship together is sex. Sexual ability deteriorates with age, but emotional intimacy and bonds grow stronger and remains with age.
I'm not Christian, but a lot of my good friends are. It's not just denomination, it's all personal, obviously. Family and friends are massive influences and can judge harshly. I find people judge you more harshly "if you have" than "if you haven't".
ReplyDeleteAre you asking for yourself or for someone who's Christinan that you're hoping to sleep with. I know a lot of guys who go to church, consider themselves Christians and sleep with their girlfriends. Girls are more reserved, I've found from just knowing them. All in all, who really cares. It's your one shot at life, do what you think is right and will make you happy in the long run. No regrets bro/sister.
P.S. Reference to Captain Jack Harkness... If if it moves
Kacey Musgraves - Follow Your Arrow
DeleteI don't think it's my business to tell anyone I know how to live their lives, as long as they're being true to themselves and what they believe in. For people who only want to experience their sexuality in the security of a marriage and only share themselves with one person, that's cool. For people who want to experience their sexuality in many ways with different partners, that's cool too. For people who want to experience their sexuality with partner(s) in committed relationships, that's also cool.
ReplyDeleteI don't understand people who partake in all sexual activities excluding penile-vaginal intercourse just to tout themselves as somehow morally superior because they're "virgins". I think if you're going to be abstaining, you need to have some sort of broader definition of sex than just penis in vagina. I'm fine even if people want to go full-Duggar and have chaperoned dates and save hand-holding for engagement and kissing for their wedding day. I don't think you have to be religious to want to save sexual activities for marriage either.
But ultimately, it's up to you.